Wednesday, February 5, 2014

1st hour: Last Fahrenheit fishbowl

Good chilly morning!

Today, we are discussing the last half of "Burning Bright", part 3 of Fahrenheit 451.  You are doing a really great job with your outer circle discussion.  Questions, overall, suggest excellent critical thinking.    We are also doing a much better job developing and supporting our thinking today.  Keep it up!

Here are a few ways to potentially direct today's discussion:

1.  Begin with comprehension questions. (level 1)
2.  Consider the ending.  What do you make of it?  To what extent was it satisfying?  Surprising?  How does it contribute to the text's bigger picture? (level 2)
3.  What do you take away from this book?  If I'm Bradbury, why did I write this text?  What am I trying to show?  To what extent do you think his messages are applicable to today's society?  Something we can learn from?  (level 3)

Happy posting!

73 comments:

  1. On page 139 we see this quote, "It was not burning, it was warming." What is making Montag see the world in a different light? How is he looking at people differently?

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    1. I think that Montag has been desensitized to fire, he worked with it all day and he kind of has no feelings when he burns them.

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    2. I think that Montag is realizing that not everything in his world is terrible like he thought it was before when he was living in the city, and this moment just shows that.

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    3. In this point of the book, Montag just feels like fire can only do bad because that is all he's seen it do, burning houses, burning knowledge, burning Beatty, just burning things away. "What did you give to the city, Montag? Ashes." (149) and when he sees this fire warming people it surprises him because for once we see the fire doing a good thing and helping people.

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  2. Why end the book with the quote "And on either side of the river was there a tree of life, which barer twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month; And the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations" (158)

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  3. I think the meaning of when Montag said that Clarisse had walked there before is that she was possibly down that road once. Clarisse could have tried to escape the town but didn't get very far doing so.

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  4. I feel like a Hound went after Clarisse because she disappeared and Beatty said that they study families such as Clarisse's. Also the government wouldn't want to raise Clarisse's awareness that they are after her because the best plan of attack is a surprise attack.

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    1. Well earlier in the book Mildred says that she saw Clarisse get hit by a car and we don't know if she saw that on the 'walls' or she saw it out the window. Knowing Mildred and her obsession with the 'family' and walls it was probably on the walls. We also know that Beatty said they had some false alarms with Clarisse's family and after getting so many, they probably wanted a way to get rid of her. They couldn't burn her house because they didn't find anything and she could have run off knowing they were after her but having a girl like her go missing, they had to make a cover up story just like how they killed a fake Montag.

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  5. If Montag never met Clarisse, would he still go down this same path he is on now? Or continue his old destructive life?

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    1. I feel that he would continue down his old destructive life because before Clarisse asked Montag if he was happy, he was happy and was continuing to live his destructive life. Then after the question, he kept thinking deeper and deeper until he realized that he was not happy. From there on he has been converting to books.

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    2. I also think that Montag would continues his old destructive life because Clarisse asked him things that really made him think about his life. If he never met Clarisse he would have never questioned what he was doing.

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    3. I think that if Montag had never met Clarisse any of this would have happened because she was the one who got him thinking about deeper things and about reading books, but before her it never even crossed his mind. On page 7, Clarisse asks Montag if he is really happy and that had never crossed his mind before her. So I think Montag wound have just gone on living life like he was.

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    4. I think that if Montag never met Clarisse then I don't think he would be even near the same path that he is on. Clarisse had a big impact on Montag in multiple ways that made Montag take a step back and re-evaluate what he is doing and where he is investing his time and thoughts. In my opinion Clarisse inspired Montag to stand up and make an impact. Clarisse showed Montag a part of life that Montag didn't really know existed anymore. She was his symbol of hope in this society.

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    5. I feel that had he never met Clarisse he would be on the same path he was before she talked to him about being happy. He didn't know what he was doing right or wrong he just did him. However, I don't think he ever felt true happiness before meeting her.

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    6. No, I think that meeting Clarisse was life changing for Montag. I think he would've just carried on with life like normal, burning books, and so forth.

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  6. What do you think motivated Montag to view things differently and with a more open mind, as he did this towards the end? What is the biggest thing that changed him?

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    1. I think the biggest thing that changed Montag was on page 7, when Clarisse asks Montag if he is happy. Once he starts to actually think about that question he starts to feel empty and the only thing that he knows that are gone, are books. Once he starts stealing more books and reading, his attitude and point of view completely changes and he realizes how much of a dystopian society he lives in.

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  7. I think that the meaning of Montag saying that he had walked down the same road as Clarisse is that he is in the same place she was in wanting people to see that books were a good thing and that people need knowledge.

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  8. On page 153 Montag says " I remember. Chicago. Chicago a long time ago. Millie and I. That's where we met!" What makes Montag remember where he met Mildred in this part of the book?

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    1. Montag must have been under pressure from the bombs and he suddenly remembers Mildred and he misses her, so he starts to have memories of him and her. He must have realized that the world to him was coming to an end and he remembers things that he never knew before.

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    2. I feel that after the city is destroyed, if Montag and his friends don't rewrite the books that they remember than they will be extinct because they are the only ones who can remember the books word for word. Also by having a bomb on the city, all the books were destroyed so they need to re-write the books.

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    3. I think that when the city was destroyed whatever was holding him back from remembering was destroyed too. When the city was gone the block in his head tumbled down and gave him back what society kept from him.

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  9. On page 146, Granger states, "When the war is over, perhaps we can be of some use in the world." Why do the outcasts think that they could possibly change the world when the war is over?

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    1. I think that because the war destroyed the city they have a black slate. So Montag and the others have an opening to bring back the knowledge of books to the remaining people. On page 156 Granger says "...born all over again. And it looks like we're doing the same thing, over and over." This quote makes me think that they are given a chance to start over, they can finally do something with the books they have memorized.

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  10. On page 148 Montag says, "It's strange, I don't miss her... Even if she dies, I realized a moment ago, I don't think I'll feel sad." What makes Montag finally realize that he doesn't care for Mildred as much as he thought he did?

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    1. I think he actually starts to realize this when he asks Mildred when they first met and neither of them could say. But at the end of the book right before the bombs hit he suddenly remembers that they met in Chicago, so I think that he realizes that even though they didn't remember things like where they met that he still cares for Mildred.

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    2. I think Montag knew he didn't care for her before this, and when she betrayed him it made him realize that. Also because she acts so much like a robot he couldn't form much of a relationship in the first place.

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    3. I think the way Mildred reacted when she found our about the books and left made Montag realize that all those years didn't mean really anything to him.

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    4. He finally realizes that it wasn't true love and that he is probably better off without her because now he is looking at things in a new way. He is accepting that it is only for the better.

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  11. Could the world they live in get better for everyone or will it get worse?

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    1. I think the world they live in could slowly get better if there begins to be more people like Montag, Clarisee, and the other outcasts. They want to pass on their information to the next generations so that their lives will possibly be better in the future.

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    2. Maybe when the war is over,the world can become a better,if people choose it to be, and maybe books can become important again.

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    3. With a leader figure like Montag directing the new world I think that the new world will be great, Montag is wise and he has learned things that others don't know.

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  12. I think Montag starts to look at things from a different perspective. He challenges his thinking and is more open to the lifestyle of others. Montag questions his thoughts a lot more than he did at the beginning of the book

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  13. On page 141 Granger says "...the police had him charted for months, years. Never know when that sort of information is handy." Do you think the society kills innocent men a lot just because they have a different pattern then the other people?

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    1. I think that they definitely do. Maybe not all the time, but I think that they do sacrifice random, innocent people to keep up their looks because the whole reason they changed the attack onto the man walking on the street was because they lost Montag but didn't want the general public to stop supporting they way they run things. When the public quits believing in the government, then the government falls and people can start rebeling to try to change the way things are run.

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    2. For some reason this society seems very caught up in keeping the audiences attention, and they know that if a chase goes on for longer than a short period of time they will lose their audience, therefore they won't see the punishment, and that could lead to other people doing the same thing because they wouldn't know punishment for their actions. Especially in this society, that can be bad.

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  14. On page 143 when Montag is talking to Granger and he tells him, "I don't belong with you... I've been an idiot all the way." Granger replies saying that they are used to it
    and that they've all made the right kind of mistakes, what do you think he means by the "right" mistakes? Does he mean rebeling and standing up for what they believe in though they got in trouble for it?

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    1. I think that Granger meant that they don't make idiot mistakes that have no point. There is always a point for there actions and when they do make mistakes the were supposed to have a meaning. All people make mistakes, the difference is there are mistakes that have a purpose and mistakes that are just made from impulsive behavior.

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  15. Out of all the ways the author could have ended the book, why do you think he made it end as it did? Do you think Montag would be able to bring books back into normal everyday life if the book was continued?

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  16. At the end of the book, they are talking about having to "remember". What exactly are the outcasts, including Montag, trying to remember? Just what they've read in books or other things?

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    1. I think that they are mostly just trying to remember the things that are in books so that they can pass them on to others and keep books and knowledge alive.

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    2. I agree with Katy I think that they try to remember what was in the books so that they can share that with the people. But then that brings up another question, why would they bother memorizing the books if they aren't going to share it with people?

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  17. Is Montag's world better or worse then Harrison's from that one short story we read?

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  18. I feel as if the city was bombed because the government knew that there were individual intelligent intellectuals who could combine to overthrow the government. Feeling threatened by these people, the government bombed them because they knew they couldn't stop them except for killing them.

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  19. On the very end of the book, on page 158, Montag remembers a passage: And on either side of the river was there a tree of life... were for the healing of the nations." Why does the author include this passage at the end of the book and why is it significant to the ending?

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  20. Why do you think the author ended the book the way he did?

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  21. Do you think books will ever be allowed,what steps does the people have to take in order for this to happen?

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    1. I think that if there are more and more people like Montag, Clarisse, and the group that he met then they will start to bring books back little by little into society, and as more people would hear the books that they memorized, the more I think they would realize that books and knowledge really are good things and over time I think that books would be allowed again.

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  22. We think that this could never happen in real life, but do you think that the events in this story could actually happen in the future? Not so much of the government "Brainwashing" us but more like technology advancing to the point there is no need for reading and over time books just wither away...

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    1. I think that we are already starting to get to that point with Kindles and audio books taking away the need for paper books to be made, but I think that there will always be people who like having real libraries and real books so I don't think we can ever get to where the society in Fahrenheit 451 is.

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    2. I don't necessarily think so because even now with the advancement of technology people can access literature though their own personal technology. They don't even have to be sitting down and actually reading, people can listen to audio books. So maybe it's possible that books themselves may become obsolete, but they can be accessed a multitude of ways. People will also read if they want to, it all depends on the person and whether or not they enjoy reading. Books play a huge part of our history, not only as a society or nation, but as an entire world as well and they are great ways to keep track of historical events.

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  23. Do you think that they removed the prison system altogether, or it's not as big as it is today in the present?

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  24. If you were living in this society, who would you follow? Montag or Utopian society?

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    1. If I was living in this society, I would follow Montag's path because being courageous and going against the system is way better than continuing to live a miserable life. Even though the journey is rough being like Montag, it's worth trying to live the way you want to live.

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  25. On page 155 after the city had been bombed Montag was wondering how many other cities around the world were dead. What makes him think that cities across the world could have been bombed? Do you think that other cities were bombed?

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  26. I would probably continue to go on because of the fear of being punished so severly for breaking a law that doesn't really matter. One example of a dystopian society is North Korea and most of the people there act like they love the government for the fear of being killed for no reason.

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  27. I would like to know how the new society would be like so I would like the author to add to the ending. One good reason for this cliff hanger is that it leaves the reader wondering about what happens next and it can lead to a sequel.

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  28. Is Montag a fool for doing all these things, or a really smart individual? Is it both?

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    1. I think he's both because by no means what he did was right but it seems like it was for the better, however sometimes when I think about it, it looks like a mistake.

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  29. Why did the government let Montag get away? Is it because they don't care about him and they just want the people to continue to be brainwashed by giving them a false sense of safety?

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    1. I think that they were starting to give up and they knew that they would have to look everywhere in order to find him, so they gave false hope because they might have been either scared of Montag or they just knew that they were never going to find him. I also think they just want to keep brainwashing people to believe that books are just a waste of time and society in how they see it is the best.

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    2. On page 141, Granger says "They know they can hold their audience for only so long. The show has to have a snap ending, quick!...They'll catch Montag in the next five minutes!" I think the government let him get away because if they had actually gone and searched for him, it would have taken them a while to find him and the society wants a fast ending to the story and to give them closure so they don't ask any questions and just move on with their lives.

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  30. Would you agree that burning Beatty was the resolution to Montag's problem and why?

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  31. If you were the big shot in this world(now think about this) would you do the same thing the government is doing?

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  32. I feel like most of the people in this society want to read and do read in secret for the fear of being killed or their houses burned. Also proof that people want to read is all the calls that the firehouse gets because of reports that people have books and are reading.

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    1. I agree, I think the fact that the firehouses still get calls about people who have hidden entire attics full of books after all these years is proof that people are still rebelling and will continue to rebel for as long as they can.

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  33. Why couldn't Montag have approached the situation of making books legal in a different way than having to resort to violence? If Montag was so against books in the beginning but one girl talked him into loving books so much he put his life on the line for them, why couldn't he talk to people like Clarice talked to him and slowly change peoples minds and opinions on books?

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    1. Because a lot of people, even today, are not as open minded then some. Think about Mildred and her friends. When Montag read them a poem; they shut him down, not willing to open their minds to books and reading.

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  34. On page 143 we see the group of men encounter Montag, "Welcome back from the dead...welcome Montag!" If you were in Montag's position, would you trust these men or would you leave?

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    1. If I was Montag, I would trust these people because they're really all I would have. They are people like me, so I would want to stick with them.

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  35. In your opinion what are the positives and negatives of the mechanical hound?

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  36. If your Job was causing harm to others, what would you do about it?

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